Ok im going to have to start enforcing these rules more then i have in the past because i have alot of people wanting to go that simply arent ready to go or arent the right spec's. This is the basic of what i expect in my raid. (Warning requirements may change from raid leader to raid leader )
First im gonna tackle healers
Paladins- Please try to have atleast 1200+ healing, roughly 10% Crit, and about a 9K mana pool Mp5 is not important for a paladin, these requirements are fairly reasonable and with the right holy build you should be able to bump your crit up more.
Resto Shamans- Im new to the class so Volwrath may have to add some things but i was thinking, About 1100+ Healing (may need to sacrifice armor class aka wear cloth) About a 6-10% crit and 9k mana pool. If i remember correctly Mp5 Is fairly important to a shaman so try to stack atleast 50 Mp5
Priest- For a priest im thinking, 1300+ healing, i would like to see about 5% crit, about a 10k mana pool and roughly 45 Mp5 (If you are having trouble i would suggest the whitemend set and the Mooncloth set Both avalible from tailoring, Whitemend i believe is Boe and mooncloth is Bop)
Druids- Not familiar with healing druids but im figuring, 1000+ healing, i dont expect much in the way of crit, a good mana pool i would say is 9k+ and a goood mp5 would be at around 30 (im not familiar with druids so if anyone has any thing to add please do)
Melee DPS!
Ok where shall i start...
Rogues- And yes blorand i know you are deffinetly gonna have to argue with this as well... Im thinking Atleast One epic weapon (try for around 78 dps im thinking Mainhand) Im thinking a good attack power would be about 1300 and try to have about 50+ hit rating, PVP specs need not apply .
Fury warriors- Dont know a whole lot about the dieing breed... The same goes for you rogues in plate ATLEAST 1 epic weapon (try to shoot for 80+ dps... show up them damn rogues) A good number of attack power would be about 1300, im thinking around 25% crit (may have to give up some armor class pve wise) And 50+ hit rating sounds good again
MS warriors- L2PVP... For pve i refuse to bring you along UNLESS i have a windfury present and then we can talk, About 1300 attack power is acceptable An Epic weapon is a must! a nice crit would be settled at around 25% 50 hit rating would be appreciated
Ret Paladins- My Home boys!...Ahem... I sadly refuse to bring you unless we have a windfury present or you are straight pve speced, A good attack power to shoot for is 1300 and a decent crit would be melee 15%, a decent mana pool would be about 5k
enhancement shamans- Not sure i spelt that right... Well vol will know this best but ive played his toon so ill go with what i know! An epic weapon would be very very nice at this point, Roughly 1300 attack power would be nice and i would say 15% crit as long as you bring da totems, A good mana pool would probably be about 5k.
Feral Dr00ds- Hehehe.... Well i never really played one or used one much but, im guessing 1300 attack power isnt unreasonable and crit around 15%, some hit rating would be a big bonus.
Ranged Phy....Huntards...
God shaved is gonna give me **** about this...
Hunters- Ok i wont lie... never played anything but a lvl 19 hunter and i hear they are difficult to auto shot and afk... Im thinking some basics would be about 1400 AP and roughly 20% crit i see an average mana of about 6k (shaved feel free to add... please! especialy spec wise)
Casters
This will include Whorelocks, Water coolers And oomkins... or i mean warlocks, mages and boomkins... and those scrubby shamans...
Mages- First i would like to suggest Tailoring IMO! Basically it boils down to i wont take ice mages period i dont find them to keep up. Arcane fire is prefered a good spell damage im looking for is 850+ and about 10K mana crit so i hear is hard to come by so 6-10% should be good (If you are having trouble.. pick up tailoring and get spellfire stuff Tenath should be able to add)
Warlocks- No you cant fear prince im sorry... Basic requirements for a lock are, i wont take you if your full Demonology so no fel guards! what i understand is an Demo/Affliction is the best spec or Straight destruction spec? (scuba and alth can tell ya) im looking for about 800+ spell damage and about 8K mana pool.
oomkins- <<<typo i swear... Ok first things first i know its hard to find leather magical damage gear, or so i hear. so im thinking its time to start picking up some cloth! another armor degrade, im shooting for about 750+ spell damage and 10% crit a good sizable mana pool would be around 9k
Ele shamans- Chain lightning PewPew... havent had much experience with it so (vol help me out) Im thinking roughly 750+ spell damage perhaps sacrifce armor again for pve gear and get some cloth, a good crit would be about 15% im guessing and a decent mana pool would hit around 10k
Tanks
yes onto the DPH
Prot warriors- For my meat sheild, uh i mea.... Im thinking that around 500 defence would be nice to start with and roughly 11k hp (If you can get exalted with sha tar for that boss sheild)
Prot pally- L2Redbar!... Im thinking 495 defence and roughly 10k hp (Also try to get exalted shield) A good sized mana pool would be about 3.5k+ and decent spell damage would be about 150+
Tanking Druids- L2battlerezwhiletanking... 430 defence i hear is decent enough and 13k health would be some what decent around 25-30% dodge would certaintly help...(has no idea how druids tank fill him in if you can)
(Please all class officers comment on what you think is reasonable)
all these requirements are UNBUFFED requirements as well
Also Healers! make sure you bring mana pots!!! this is a requirement!!
(Most of the crit was determinded not including stuff from specs)
Hunters, go look in the hunter thread for some good benchmarks.
Vital basic stats by spec for STARTING kara:
MM: 1850 AP with Aspect of the Hawk and True Shot Aura 20% crit 50 hit rating 6k mana is absolute MINIMUM so stop wearing rogue gear
BM: 1600 AP with Aspect of the Hawk 20% crit 65 hit rating 6k mana.......... bring pots nub, your spec has no efficiency talents
SV: 500 agility!!!! Expose Weakness is your raid buff AND your TSA, don't be a nub and have this proc for less than TSA (125). 1500 AP with Aspect of the Hawk 25% crit 20 hit rating (surefooted for the win) 6k mana
Shot rotations are even more important than stats. If the terms "global cooldown" or "clip the autoshot" are new to you, go check out the hunter guideslinked to in the guild hunter forums.
-- Edited by shaved at 14:11, 2007-07-20
-- Edited by shaved at 16:14, 2007-07-20
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Since i THINK, and i may be wrong about this, but i THINK i'm the only BM who's actively in kara, I feel that "bring pots nub" comment was directed at me!
But I never have mana problems....cause my bow speed is fast enough all i can do without mesing up the rotation is steady shot, auto shot....with an occassional multi-shot thrown in for group pulls.
Every hunter would agree with me in saying that BM is one of the most overpowered and least gear intensive specs out there, although gear dramatically increases DPS. I would even go so far as saying that overall, +hit would be one of the most important stat increases in a kara raid. Sure, I pump out great DPS, but I think if i had better +to hit (i'm sitting at a measly 77), my dps might bump up a few dozen points.
Again, this is all speculation, and I don't have the hard facts like shaved does, but I feel the way I play my hunter is the only way I'm comfortable playing him.
Lane is right, BM needs more hit than other specs. I kind of forgot that point. I'll edit the top post. Remember that these stats are for STARTING kara, not one-shotting Prince.
And you're right. You don't need pots for most fights with a special/auto (2 per cycle) rotation like you'd need them for a steady/instant/auto (3 per cycle) rotation like Nightshift and I use.
MM and SV have efficiency talents, so the more mana-intensive rotation can be maintained for longer. BM can't fit the extra intants in between steady/auto without clipping, so they get a break on mana that way. But they end up firing more total shots.
But on Prince, you do run close to oom. And you do pot to stay "in the blue". (I think)
I run oom on prince without thrill of the hunt unless I use lots of pots and use them early.
btw, hunter hit cap is:
Hit Rating: 15.77 HR = 1% Hit Hit Percent: 1% Hit ~ 0.9% DPS Hit Cap: 136 Standard - 89 w/ Sure Footed.
Raw stat breakdowns follow:
1 Agility: 2 Armor; 1 AP; 0.025% Crit; 0.04% Dodge Total Agility: Crit% = (0.025 * TotalAgility) - 1.56 1 Stamina: 10 HP 1 Intellect: 15 Mana Attack Power: 14 AP ~ 1.0 Paper Doll White DPS Attack Power: 10-11 AP ~ 1.0 Actual Auto-Shot DPS Crit Rating: 22.1 CR = 1% Crit Crit Percent: 1% Crit ~ 1.03% DPS (with Mortal Shots) Gear Comp. Value: 2 AP ~ 1 Agi ~ 1 CR (Adjust for Spec)
-- Edited by shaved at 16:15, 2007-07-20
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1400+ attack power (with BoM) 20% (min) reg Melee crit (this allows useful dps on spell resistance mobs) Spell : 15% min spell crit : 400+ spell damage : -this allows for spell crits of roughly 1.5-2.5k crits on top of your white crits-
This is not impossible to attain. in fact with old FM gear you gain -MOST- of these base stats. Get GM gear and good gems and you can hit and move past it. (arena +crit gear is great for pve)
+melee attack power trinket, and Plus spell damage/heal trinket allow for more burst damage. (and boost to heals when needed)
I can have the 108.5dps +40 stam + 50 str mace created -if- this is a serious attempt to play as ret (and not some joke).
Above all the person being brought (at least for g-2 I believe I can speak for shaved in this), the person MUST understand the utility of the class and not be a ZOMG I AM LEET DPS. (and yes I can make many rogues and warlocks sick as I pass them on dps meter hehe). The whole reason to bring a ret pali is for CS to keep seals up, -panic healing-, and added versitility of DPS and light off tanking in a -must save a healer- situation.
Above all the person being brought (at least for g-2 I believe I can speak for shaved in this), the person MUST understand the utility of the class and not be a ZOMG I AM LEET DPS.
/agree
A few classes have "utility" specs. Shadow priests, Survival hunters, and obviously Retribution paladins.
Can you dps?
yes
Is it gear-dependant?
you bet!
Should you "just do it to try it"? not in my raid (and I assume areal's also)
Does it require a lot of knowledge, thinking and micromanagement?
yes
Do you have that kind of expertise?
I don't know, but I'm not going into a Prince encounter with you specced like that to find out.
Why is Myrid allowed to go ret?
Myrid has earned the right to go ret in G-2 by impressing me greatly as a healer. He's secured that right by NOT going ret until he knows that a) we have the heals to do kara without him healing at all, and b) he has the gear and experience to make ret really shine.
Why does shaved get to be survival?
Because I'm the damned raid leader for G-2, and 3/4 of our dps is physical. My Expose Weakness put Nightshift at about 2500 RAP. Do you have 726 unbuffed agility?
= ) See you tonight Myrid.
-- Edited by shaved at 23:21, 2007-07-20
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Rogues- And yes blorand i know you are deffinetly gonna have to argue with this as well... Im thinking Atleast One epic weapon (try for around 78 dps im thinking Mainhand) Im thinking a good attack power would be about 1300 and try to have about 50+ hit rating, PVP specs need not apply
Two things about this. If you are going to get an epic weapon make it a mainhand weapon meaning for daggers 1.7+ speed and swords/fist/lolmace 2.5+ the mainhand for a rogue is much more important than our offhand. Also for your attack power aim for above 1200 but try to stack hit rating to around 100+. Hit rating is our most important stat and you are basically aiming to have it just under 308 as that is our cap with weapon expertise. A last comment about the pvp specs. The only spec you should have is 19/42/0 or 20/41/0..the point is..go deep combat with some assassination..sub=bad!
I'd say for DPS you'd want like 1800ish AP? My druid's damage gear isn't super hot, but I have over 2200 AP self buffed and around 29% crit. That might be a bit high, but I'd say 25% to crit and at least 1700 AP is easily attainable with blues.
Druid tanks I'd say 18k armor, 25% dodge, 13k hp maybe? Druids only need 415 defense if they have Survival of the Fittest (and you damn well better have it if you even think of tanking). I'm not sure really but Tunvalis is sitting at like just over 22k armor, 28% dodge or so but has kind of low hp at around 12-13k.
Warrior tanking, 490 def. After that work on dodge, parry, block. About 11k stam should be fine and like 12k armor is what I started Kara with. No heroic gear or epics except my weapon. You can easily get the stuff you need from level 70 instances.
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